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Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2018 23:47:34 GMT
I doubt there is a school in the U.K. that mentions Hamilton in the whole school at any time, let alone the American Revolution, let alone the American political system. Maybe if Trump changes that, because teachers can inform pupils of the system etc, then that is one good thing he can do. I will happily retract that if Parsley or anyone else can find me a school that teaches about Hamilton. See above Everything young People don’t know about Is due to it not being covered at school?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2018 23:47:39 GMT
No Parsley. You suggested that, when you insinuated if his son went to school he would know the plot. Know your own argument.
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Post by lynette on Jan 5, 2018 23:48:09 GMT
And no, people don’t get to learn about the American political system when they are school age. If they see the show, they may take an interest. If the songs break into the mainstream, they might find out more. Parsley you live in a different world to most young people. I don’t doubt you make a contribution to that world but your comment was hasty and I’m not surprised it caused offence.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2018 23:48:21 GMT
I doubt there is a school in the U.K. that mentions Hamilton in the whole school at any time, let alone the American Revolution, let alone the American political system. Maybe if Trump changes that, because teachers can inform pupils of the system etc, then that is one good thing he can do. I will happily retract that if Parsley or anyone else can find me a school that teaches about Hamilton. American school St. John’s Wood
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Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2018 23:51:14 GMT
No Parsley. You suggested that, when you insinuated if his son went to school he would know the plot. Know your own argument. It was in fact started on page 327 And has been commented on by others That the story of Hamilton is not well known Due to it not being covered in UK schools I know of several schools who have covered American history many schools teach above and outside the national curriculum Furthermore the national curriculum only applies to state government schools Private and independent schools do not have to follow this And often offer other options
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Post by lynette on Jan 5, 2018 23:51:53 GMT
I doubt there is a school in the U.K. that mentions Hamilton in the whole school at any time, let alone the American Revolution, let alone the American political system. Maybe if Trump changes that, because teachers can inform pupils of the system etc, then that is one good thing he can do. I will happily retract that if Parsley or anyone else can find me a school that teaches about Hamilton. See above Everything young People don’t know about Is due to it not being covered at school? And don’t you put me a quote box and come back with some fatuous remark.
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Post by Cardinal Pirelli on Jan 5, 2018 23:55:18 GMT
I doubt there is a school in the U.K. that mentions Hamilton in the whole school at any time, let alone the American Revolution, let alone the American political system. Maybe if Trump changes that, because teachers can inform pupils of the system etc, then that is one good thing he can do. I will happily retract that if Parsley or anyone else can find me a school that teaches about Hamilton. It's on one of the exam board syllabuses (Edexcel, I think) for history, but the other few miss it out. Politics A Level students will be most likely study the US political system. As for Hamilton there are a uniquely substantial amount of students who know about this period purely because they know about the show and have the cast recording. It really is a phenomenon in that respect.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2018 23:55:47 GMT
No Parsley. You suggested that, when you insinuated if his son went to school he would know the plot. Know your own argument. It was in fact started on page 327 And has been commented on by others That the story of Hamilton is not well known Due to it not being covered in UK schools I know of several schools who have covered American history many schools teach above and outside the national curriculum Furthermore the national curriculum only applies to state government schools Private and independent schools do not have to follow this And often offer other options Nice to see that you like your own post there, Parse.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2018 23:58:32 GMT
And no, people don’t get to learn about the American political system when they are school age. If they see the show, they may take an interest. If the songs break into the mainstream, they might find out more. Parsley you live in a different world to most young people. I don’t doubt you make a contribution to that world but your comment was hasty and I’m not surprised it caused offence. Just like his post on a different thread then? “Breaking news, Parsley the Prince of Misery goes to a play and slags everyone off!! Cant he find another hobby so he doesnt clog up this forum?”
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2018 0:01:29 GMT
Honestly, when I was at school, I didn't have a lot of spare time to set myself to learning stuff that the curriculum didn't cover, and what spare time I did have between the homework, part time job, and various activities, I devoted solely to fun. Maybe the history of US politics is fun to some teens - especially now, thanks to this show - but it was a bit more about Terry Pratchett and The X-Files for me. I've got far more knowledge about and interest in the world generally now that I'm older and learning stuff is a hobby rather than a way of life, and I'd be very suspicious of anyone who claims that they loooooved supplementing their school life with additional voluntary school-type learning rather than playing violin or hanging out with friends.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2018 0:03:36 GMT
From The government guidelines on KS3
Key stage 3 Pupils should extend and deepen their chronologically secure knowledge and understanding of British, local and world history, so that it provides a well-informed context for wider learning. Pupils should identify significant events, make connections, draw contrasts, and analyse trends within periods and over long arcs of time. They should use historical terms and concepts in increasingly sophisticated ways. They should pursue historically valid enquiries including some they have framed themselves, and create relevant, structured and evidentially supported accounts in response. They should understand how different types of historical sources are used rigorously to make historical claims and discern how and why contrasting arguments and interpretations of the past have been constructed.
Examples (non-statutory) the Enlightenment in Europe and Britain, with links back to 17th-century thinkers and scientists and the founding of the Royal Society Britain’s transatlantic slave trade: its effects and its eventual abolition the Seven Years War and THE AMERICAN WAR OF INDEPENDENCE the French Revolutionary wars Britain as the first industrial nation – the impact on society party politics, extension of the franchise and social reform the development of the British Empire with a depth study (for example, of India)
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2018 0:06:08 GMT
Non-statutory.
You can capitalise all you like.
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Post by Phantom of London on Jan 6, 2018 0:10:34 GMT
All schools state and private cover the Boston Tea Party, the story of Hamilton is just an extention of that.
If a child had no knowledge and comes away from the musical and expands their mind, that would be awesome, if they don’t - then nothing really lost.
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Post by talkstageytome on Jan 6, 2018 1:24:49 GMT
Love the implication over the previous couple of pages that people who educate themselves outside of school must be geniuses with encyclopedic knowledge of everything including the American Revolutionary War. And also the implication that there is anyone in the world who ONLY learns things at school, and never in their own time. What a strange thread this has taken. For what it's worth, I only did History in HS up until year 9, and I don't really recall learning anything about the American Revolution. That's not to say that we definitely did or didn't cover it, but it's not something I really remember learning about at that time. I'd say that the musical is written, structured and staged in such a way that it's quite easy to follow, and even if you do get lost, there's lots of narration to keep the story moving forwards. I was aware of that period of history and had listened to the cast album a couple of times before I went, but someone I went with had not, and she could still follow the story pretty well. Quite a lot of it focuses on the characters and their interpersonal relationships, and that aspect is particularly easy to follow, and really interesting too. Changing the subject for a second, seeing the show has given me a newfound love of lots of the songs I always used to skip over before. Some of the lyrics are extremely clever and for anyone interested in the rap references / general clever writing in the show, this article is very interesting... graphics.wsj.com/hamilton/
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Post by daniel on Jan 6, 2018 1:30:41 GMT
Just to echo what talkstageytome said above - I did history at school and other than the Native Americans, Midwest and the Slave trade we didn't really do much else about the US. Incidentally, I feel like I have learned things from listening to the Hamilton cast recording, and other random bits of reading that I've done off the back of that.
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Post by 72arodney on Jan 6, 2018 2:59:24 GMT
Replacing 'free' for 'nationalised', wasn't that the argument for the rail service to be privatised.... and look at that. That's expensive and it's horsesh*t. I don’t use trains Other than the tube And that is excellent Runs much better than the NHS On time quick clean and efficient Reliable So you don't live in London then?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2018 14:11:36 GMT
"Poster in Question" has left the building (temporarily no doubt, loves a flounce after all). And it seems moot. Buuuut.
I have a degree in American Studies and History. I trained as a History teacher. Funny enough in all that time I didn't spend 1 minute learning more about Alexander Hamilton than what was required of my courses because...well there's a lot of history out there, and he wasn't top of my list (sorry dude). And because much of the teaching and writing about him was dull. Had I had Hamilton, I might have been inspired to read a bit more.
But obviously the above means I'm incredibly stupid, ignornant etc etc. Because *Shock Horror* I was taught via the National Curriculum. (as a former teacher I'm no great lover of the thing but to imply those taught under it are all ignorant ironically displays some spectacular ignorance)
Anyway, can we get back to politics yo?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2018 14:33:48 GMT
Oh and also given we've talked about it here, NC History DOES teach about Mormons which led to this gem from a Year 9
"Miss, Miss these Mormon's yeah?" "Yes little Johnny" "Proper boring aren't they?"
At that point obviously a quick blast of "Spooky Mormon Hell Dream" would have at least livened things up. (I couldn't disagree the teaching about Mormons is as boring as sin).
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Post by Dawnstar on Jan 6, 2018 15:36:03 GMT
I did American political history as part of A Level history & it included studying the War of Independence but I don't recall Hamilton being mentioned or, if he was, it was in such a minor way that it awoke no recollection a dozen years later when the show became famous.
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Xanderl
Member
Not always very high value in terms of ticket yield or donations
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Post by Xanderl on Jan 6, 2018 16:00:23 GMT
In the introduction to the biography, Ron Chernow makes the point that Hamilton is less well known than the other founding fathers due to his early death and one of the points of the book (and consequently the musical) is to redress the balance. So probably not surprising that even people over here relatively familiar with US history didn't know much about him.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2018 22:19:04 GMT
It would be really awful if Rachel did not win an Olivier Award !
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Post by ellie1981 on Jan 7, 2018 1:56:47 GMT
I certainly don’t remember learning anything about the Boston Tea Party. The only American History we learned in school was about slavery which wasn’t exclusive to America. In fact we did very little outside of centuries old British history. It was a thrill the one time when we did South Africa and Apartheid because it was something from within our own lifetime.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 7, 2018 9:31:28 GMT
Finally going tomorrow! Two quick questions to those that have already been:
- where is the cast board located?
- is there a cloakroom?
Thanks!
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Post by charliec on Jan 7, 2018 9:45:58 GMT
Finally going tomorrow! Two quick questions to those that have already been: - where is the cast board located? - is there a cloakroom? Thanks! Yep there’s a cloakroom, If I remember correctly it’s just off to the right when you walk in the main door. There is a digital cast board on the left in the main entrance hall.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 7, 2018 12:24:25 GMT
Finally going tomorrow! Two quick questions to those that have already been: - where is the cast board located? - is there a cloakroom? Thanks! Yep there’s a cloakroom, If I remember correctly it’s just off to the right when you walk in the main door. There is a digital cast board on the left in the main entrance hall. Great, thanks for your reply!
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Post by HereForTheatre on Jan 7, 2018 15:00:00 GMT
Saw it last night.
I went in nearly totally blind. I'd only heard the King George song and Room Where It Happens.
So really i could take all the cast for what they were rather than comparing them to anyone.
I would say it does live up to the hype. Even as someone who really isn't interested in rap music or would choose to listen to it. The feeling i got when watching was always one of it being a real experience and thing to witness. I thought everything combined well and even though the set was pretty static they were able to create some really wow and stunning moments through the revolve, choreography and most of all, i think, the lighting, which was most excellent. I loved the big harmonies as well, which were very powerful. Oh and one thing i didn't expect was when the character would suddenly break into the mimicking and quite 'childish' kinda comedy stuff, which i thought was funny. Especially when it was Hamilton. I surprisingly enjoyed the rap but it certainly was the sung-through songs and more musical theatre stuff that i enjoyed most.
I thought Jamal was excellent, though wish he had a slightly better singing voice because i didn't expect him to have a couple of sung through songs. But it was at least serviceable. I thought he did a great job of being credible as both the younger and older Hamilton.We had the understudy on for Aaron Burr, so i was slightly disappointed not to see Giles but again, he was excellent, but strangely enough had the same little niggle about his singing voice. I can imagine Giles sings it a bit better. I'd read the criticism of Rachelle Ann Go as Eliza, but not having anyone to compare her to, i thought she was very good and certainly had no problem with her singing at least! I was looking forward to seeing Rachel John, having been impressed with her in other things, then after the glowing reviews on here, and she was indeed great, but i was expecting a much bigger part than she had, or at least another big song. All the others were great and i especially enjoyed the guy playing George Washington, who had an excellent presence and a great voice. I wasn't too sure on Jason Pennycooks Lafayette, mostly because i couldn't understand anything he was rapping and also i swear he sounded more German at times that French?! But he was great as Jefferson in act 2. Oh and Micheal Jibson was great as King George. Loved him.I kept seeing comments about his singing but he sounded good to me? People loved him.
There was a very annoying loud American man behind me loudly laughing at the strangest of times and moments, which was both annoying and distracting but also quite baffling. I can only imagine he saw/understood things that went over most others heads as someone who would be more clued up on this stuff? No idea.
So i thought it was great and an experience but i'm unsure if i will see it again anytime soon. For me, even though i enjoyed it a lot, in the nicest of ways, it felt quite a long and taxing show for me, especially with the amount one had to concentrate to follow all the rapping and story, and of course, it is basically a history lesson as well. Afterwards, I felt a little exhausted and like i'd seen it, really enjoyed it, but also had my experience and didn't really want to do it again. For me it doesn't feel like a show i could go back to time after time like a more easy going show like a Kinky Boots or Dreamgirls or such. But having said that, maybe now i know the story and wouldn't have to be so focused on picking up everything, it might be easier a next time, and probably especially if i maybe went and saw the other Hamilton and lead Burr. We'll see.
4.5 stars.
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Post by lynette on Jan 7, 2018 15:03:53 GMT
Thanks Andy. You have highlighted the reason I got the cd.
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Post by poster J on Jan 7, 2018 16:17:33 GMT
I was looking forward to seeing Rachel John, having been impressed with her in other things, then after the glowing reviews on here, and she was indeed great, but i was expecting a much bigger part than she had, or at least another big song. Angelica is one of the supporting female roles - Eliza is the lead - so it is naturally going to be more limited in terms of stage time. I think she gets the better songs of the two though, and it's a much sassier part.
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Post by jankih on Jan 9, 2018 10:38:12 GMT
Yesterday was Marsha Songcomes first show as "Eliza", did anyone happen to catch her? I'm actually dying to hear how she was :-O
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Post by charliec on Jan 9, 2018 11:44:53 GMT
Yesterday was Marsha Songcomes first show as "Eliza", did anyone happen to catch her? I'm actually dying to hear how she was :-O I was there! I really liked her version of Eliza, her Burn was full of anger and emotion. I thought her and Ash Hunter (on for his scheduled alternate performance last night) were really believable together. There were a couple of mistakes but totally understandable considering it was her first time on in that role. I thought she gave a far more nuanced, interesting and spirited performance than I've seen from Rachelle Ann Go thus far. I'd love to see what she could do given time to develop in the role. I really loved Ash as Hamilton as well. Where Jamael goes for a quiet controlled determination, Ash is far more energetic and emotional, like Javier Munoz on Broadway he is a bit more smiley and excitable than I've seen others do it. I loved his version of Hurricane.
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