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Post by Jon on Oct 31, 2019 21:08:16 GMT
Spinning this thread from discussions in the Almeida 2020 thread. While there are playwrights and plays that seem to come around every couple of years like Arthur Miller, Noel Coward, Shakespeare etc there are others that don't get the same treatments. I wonder why that is, is it to do with the rights holders or simply that some playwrights or plays simply fall out of favour for a time.
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Post by Jan on Nov 1, 2019 7:14:37 GMT
Spinning this thread from discussions in the Almeida 2020 thread. While there are playwrights and plays that seem to come around every couple of years like Arthur Miller, Noel Coward, Shakespeare etc there are others that don't get the same treatments. I wonder why that is, is it to do with the rights holders or simply that some playwrights or plays simply fall out of favour for a time. Fashion plays a big part, there were a couple of decades at least where there were no major productions of any Terence Rattigan plays, but then there were several. He was very popular in his day but then was seen as old fashioned when the next wave of new playwrights emerged (John Osborne etc.) and then had to wait to be "re-assessed". Arthur Miller followed a similar trajectory in USA actually, he was absent from Broadway for years. You can see the same cycle with many writers, Osborne himself, Arnold Wesker, J.B.Priestley, Peter Shaffer - there are very few who remain continuously popular but the good ones always come back again. |
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Post by barrowside on Nov 1, 2019 11:53:47 GMT
Quite strangely Brian Friel's great plays are getting major productions in London much more than in Dublin nowadays.
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Post by talkingheads on Nov 1, 2019 12:11:42 GMT
There are a lot of vintage Alan Bennett plays I'd love to see in the West End. Also I've only seen an excerpt on the National 50 Years On Stage but Peter Nichols The National Health and Hare/Brenton's Pravda are two I really want to see at some stage.
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Post by oxfordsimon on Nov 1, 2019 12:29:52 GMT
Fashions - as in all art and culture forms - do come and go.
We very rarely hear of performances of plays by William Douglas Home these days - but he was incredibly popular in his time.
Rattigan was out of fashion for a long, long time and then had a revival.
I suspect we are going to get an explosion of some of the rarer Shaw plays once he drops out of copyright.
With the change in the way the exam texts for GCSE and A levels were chosen, that saw a drop off in performances of set plays when the choices open to schools were opened up. Now with the more recent reintroduction of a more limited range, the number of key texts that get performed because of the ready availability of school groups who need to see a given play live has increased.
Some classic plays will never go from the active repertoire - because they are too good and too popular. The way they get done will change - but the core repertoire is there because of quality and audience appeal. Thankfully there are producers and artistic directors who actively seek out the rare and unusual - which then prompt a revival in fortunes elsewhere because people spot a long-forgotten writer and mount more of their work.
Rodney Ackland was a case in point. He was all but forgotten but when The Orange Tree and then the National revived Absolute Hell (not the most recent version), that saw an uptick in exploration of the rest of his work.
A good play will more than likely remain a good play - it is just a matter of finding them and championing them.
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Post by learfan on Nov 1, 2019 18:13:07 GMT
Im hoping for some Shaw next year and beyond and not just at the Orange Tree! He's always been popular at Chichester for instance.
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Post by Jon on Nov 1, 2019 18:22:33 GMT
In terms of playwrights who are done often but some plays are done more than others, Rosencrantz and Guildenstern Are Dead by Tom Stoppard is done quite a fair bit as is The Real Thing but some of his plays like The Invention of Love, The Coast of Utopia etc have yet to receive a revival the latter though I suspect it's because it's three plays and costly to put on.
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Post by NorthernAlien on Nov 1, 2019 23:23:34 GMT
Sometimes a script that was deemed 'amazing' just turns out not to be very good! The Finborough makes a great fuss around 'this play hasn't been produced for {x} years' - and having seen some of those shows, to be frank, its easy to see why.
With newer scripts, I feel that they often get a run and then disappear because they've been rushed to a public performance too soon - part of this is because of the way much theatre gets made in this country now - theatre-makers with no cash who can't get project funding from ACE bang stuff out and it's just not ready, but they don't have the money to be able to develop it more, and commercial producers who might be inclined to punt a bit of cash at developing something can't possibly see every show, and frankly there's a huge element of both luck, and knowing the right people.
'Six' started off as a Cambridge Footlights show - the sort of student drama soc that again has more resources than most, which meant it could go to Edinburgh where Kenny Wax (or one of his people) did see it and picked it up. 'Come from Away' spent about 5 years in development before it opened on Broadway, and had the good fortune to cross paths with a renowned development theatre in North America as it was being written - which again brought it into the orbit of commercial producers. From what I read today, '& Juliet' has been in workshops etc for about 4 years, and they've been tweaking it during the Manchester run (as many posters on this board noted at the time). Of these, I've only seen Come From Away, and I really loved it - but will it still be loved in 20 years time, or will something have happened to change the currently overwhelming positive responses to it?
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Post by lynette on Nov 2, 2019 4:26:04 GMT
Plays can ‘date’. I don’t think the political rants of today will be much performed in the future but funnily enough some plays which are pinned into their time can actually improve with age. I’m thinking of the Pinter season we had recently with it’s painful evocation of poor tented accommodation and sparse meals. It is about the quality of the writing. Some of Ben Jonson has ‘died’ because of the contemporary satire we no longer understand whereas Shakespeare’s contemporary references get through to us despite the centuries. With a bit of homework. 🤪
I’d like to see some of the stuff David Garrick performed and produced.
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Post by learfan on Nov 2, 2019 5:55:40 GMT
In terms of playwrights who are done often but some plays are done more than others, Rosencrantz and Guildenstern Are Dead by Tom Stoppard is done quite a fair bit as is The Real Thing but some of his plays like The Invention of Love, The Coast of Utopia etc have yet to receive a revival the latter though I suspect it's because it's three plays and costly to put on. Jumpers (almost 20 years since the last revival) and Night and Day, never revived as far as i know despite a successful WE run and Broadway transfer. Doubt Utopia will get a revival, good as it was, its just too massive. |
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Post by Polly1 on Nov 2, 2019 8:25:15 GMT
In terms of playwrights who are done often but some plays are done more than others, Rosencrantz and Guildenstern Are Dead by Tom Stoppard is done quite a fair bit as is The Real Thing but some of his plays like The Invention of Love, The Coast of Utopia etc have yet to receive a revival the latter though I suspect it's because it's three plays and costly to put on. Jumpers (almost 20 years since the last revival) and Night and Day, never revived as far as i know despite a successful WE run and Broadway transfer. Doubt Utopia will get a revival, good as it was, its just too massive. Has Indian Ink ever been revived? That's one I would like to see. |
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Post by duncan on Nov 2, 2019 8:55:55 GMT
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Post by learfan on Nov 2, 2019 11:11:49 GMT
Jumpers (almost 20 years since the last revival) and Night and Day, never revived as far as i know despite a successful WE run and Broadway transfer. Doubt Utopia will get a revival, good as it was, its just too massive. Has Indian Ink ever been revived? That's one I would like to see. Dont think so, it had a reasonable run in the WE. |
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Post by oxfordsimon on Nov 2, 2019 11:24:09 GMT
Cockpit does sound fascinating I shall track down a script |
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Post by joem on Nov 3, 2019 0:45:35 GMT
Very little Middleton or Ben Jonson. Or John Shirley.
Eliot's last two plays are never revived, except maybe in fringe productions. Christopher Fry?
Very little classical Spanish or French drama.
Absurdists such as Adamov, Frisch, Vian are never performed
What's the last time Nobel Prize winner Peter Handke had anything done in London?
Auden and Isherwood? I can only remember one recent production, of The Dog Beneath the Skin at the Jermyn Street Theatre.
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Post by Jan on Nov 3, 2019 8:08:41 GMT
Feydeau farces, Aldwych farces, Whitehall farces. All too entertaining for our Puritan times.
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Post by learfan on Nov 3, 2019 8:28:43 GMT
Very little Middleton or Ben Jonson. Or John Shirley. Eliot's last two plays are never revived, except maybe in fringe productions. Christopher Fry? Very little classical Spanish or French drama. Absurdists such as Adamov, Frisch, Vian are never performed What's the last time Nobel Prize winner Peter Handke had anything done in London? Auden and Isherwood? I can only remember one recent production, of The Dog Beneath the Skin at the Jermyn Street Theatre. Actually Middleton is done fairly often, Women Beware Women is on at the Sam Wanamaker this winter. The Italian Revengers Tragedy is on at the Barbican next Spring. The RSC have done a few of his recently. However Jonson a much better known writer only survives due to Volpone and Alchemist revivals. His other work barely gets a look in. |
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Post by joem on Nov 3, 2019 8:56:39 GMT
I hear you, but out of the thirty odd plays attributed to Middleton I believe only a handful have been performed in living memory. Tends to be the same 4 or 5 revived.
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Post by learfan on Nov 3, 2019 10:16:44 GMT
Forgot to mention Jonson's Silent Woman is being dome by Edward's Boys at King Edward's School in Stratford next spring.
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Post by Polly1 on Nov 3, 2019 10:56:01 GMT
There was a production of Frisch's The Arsonists (Fireraisers) at the Court in 2007 (with Benedict Cumberbatch no less) but I agree that seems to be the only one of his plays still done.
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Post by Jan on Nov 3, 2019 12:58:41 GMT
Very little Middleton or Ben Jonson. Or John Shirley. Eliot's last two plays are never revived, except maybe in fringe productions. Christopher Fry? Very little classical Spanish or French drama. Absurdists such as Adamov, Frisch, Vian are never performed What's the last time Nobel Prize winner Peter Handke had anything done in London? Auden and Isherwood? I can only remember one recent production, of The Dog Beneath the Skin at the Jermyn Street Theatre. Actually Middleton is done fairly often, Women Beware Women is on at the Sam Wanamaker this winter. The Italian Revengers Tragedy is on at the Barbican next Spring. The RSC have done a few of his recently. However Jonson a much better known writer only survives due to Volpone and Alchemist revivals. His other work barely gets a look in. I’ve seen nine different plays by Ben Jonson so he’s not that rare. However I’ve only seen one by Marivaux (and that quite recently) even though he wrote loads. Same with Corneille. |
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Post by Cardinal Pirelli on Nov 3, 2019 13:24:21 GMT
Actually Middleton is done fairly often, Women Beware Women is on at the Sam Wanamaker this winter. The Italian Revengers Tragedy is on at the Barbican next Spring. The RSC have done a few of his recently. However Jonson a much better known writer only survives due to Volpone and Alchemist revivals. His other work barely gets a look in. I’ve seen nine different plays by Ben Jonson so he’s not that rare. However I’ve only seen one by Marivaux (and that quite recently) even though he wrote loads. Same with Corneille. I’ve seen a few Marivaux plays here, infinitely preferable to Moliere in my opinion - The Dispute, Game of Love and Chance, The False Servant, maybe one or two more. On Middleton it’s only recently that attribution of The Revenger’s Tragedy has bumped up his numbers. One relatively recent playwright, starting in the early seventies, who I’ve mentioned as disappearing from theatre as he moved to the small screen, is Poliakoff. Arden and Wesker and, from the USA, Saroyan and Odets. Plenty have fallen by the wayside for various reasons. |
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Post by oxfordsimon on Nov 3, 2019 16:40:08 GMT
One of the most frequently performed current US writers is Lauren Gunderson - who has had very few UK professional productions. I and You at the Hampstead (with Maisie Williams) being the highest profile one that I am aware of.
Friends of mine have a local amateur company and have done two UK premieres of her work - and they were well received.
But she seems to be almost entirely under the radar here despite being in the top 20 performed writers in the US and is the most produced living US writer for the stage. She does write quite a lot about women in science but also has written pieces inspired by Shakespeare and Austen.
Worth a look if you are in the market for something a bit different (and I am not on commission!!)
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Post by bordeaux on Nov 3, 2019 18:10:34 GMT
Fans of lost classics should try and visit the Shaw Festival at Niagara-on-the-Lake once in their lives (and couple it with a trip to Stratford, Ontario). Their brief is to put on plays from Shaw's era and they quite often have some intriguing rarities. I saw Rodney Ackland's The Old Ladies in 2002 when I was there. I think a lot of these plays are merely of historical interest, though. The major rediscoveries of relatively unknown British plays in my theatre-going life have been Ackland's Absolute Hell, Rattigan's After the Dance and Githa Sowerby's Rutherford and Son (I'm thinking of the Katie Mitchell production with Bob Peck).
John Whiting and James Saunders are once biggish names who've been forgotten. The former's Penny for a Song was done twenty years or so ago in the Whitehall theatre, I seem to remember. I could imagine someone doing something interesting with his Devils (filmed by Ken Russell).
Amongst US playwrights with a big name, I'm always surprised how little John Guare we've seen over here in major productions. The only one I can recall is Six Degrees of Separation.
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Post by Jan on Nov 3, 2019 20:01:21 GMT
Fans of lost classics should try and visit the Shaw Festival at Niagara-on-the-Lake once in their lives (and couple it with a trip to Stratford, Ontario). Their brief is to put on plays from Shaw's era and they quite often have some intriguing rarities. I saw Rodney Ackland's The Old Ladies in 2002 when I was there. I think a lot of these plays are merely of historical interest, though. The major rediscoveries of relatively unknown British plays in my theatre-going life have been Ackland's Absolute Hell, Rattigan's After the Dance and Githa Sowerby's Rutherford and Son (I'm thinking of the Katie Mitchell production with Bob Peck). John Whiting and James Saunders are once biggish names who've been forgotten. The former's Penny for a Song was done twenty years or so ago in the Whitehall theatre, I seem to remember. I could imagine someone doing something interesting with his Devils (filmed by Ken Russell). Amongst US playwrights with a big name, I'm always surprised how little John Guare we've seen over here in major productions. The only one I can recall is Six Degrees of Separation. I saw the RSC productions of both Penny for a Song and The Devils, both in the 1980s, neither much good but maybe worth another revival. |
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Post by Polly1 on Nov 3, 2019 20:14:18 GMT
I remember seeing a touring version of The Old Ladies in 2003. Great cast (Sian Phillips, Rosemary Leach, Angela Thorne), terrible play. Had to look up details as apart from title and how awful it was, had no recollection.
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Post by learfan on Nov 3, 2019 21:37:09 GMT
Fans of lost classics should try and visit the Shaw Festival at Niagara-on-the-Lake once in their lives (and couple it with a trip to Stratford, Ontario). Their brief is to put on plays from Shaw's era and they quite often have some intriguing rarities. I saw Rodney Ackland's The Old Ladies in 2002 when I was there. I think a lot of these plays are merely of historical interest, though. The major rediscoveries of relatively unknown British plays in my theatre-going life have been Ackland's Absolute Hell, Rattigan's After the Dance and Githa Sowerby's Rutherford and Son (I'm thinking of the Katie Mitchell production with Bob Peck). John Whiting and James Saunders are once biggish names who've been forgotten. The former's Penny for a Song was done twenty years or so ago in the Whitehall theatre, I seem to remember. I could imagine someone doing something interesting with his Devils (filmed by Ken Russell). Amongst US playwrights with a big name, I'm always surprised how little John Guare we've seen over here in major productions. The only one I can recall is Six Degrees of Separation. [b A trip to The Shaw Festival and Stratford Canada Fest is on my bucket list. Sadly such a trip is way beyond my budget so will have to wait for retirement. |
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Post by emsworthian on Nov 6, 2019 10:45:32 GMT
Hi, Learfan. Those two are on my bucket list as well. We have relatives in Ottowa and went out two years ago to stay with them and explore the city and 1,000 islands. They said that the next time they would take us to Toronto and Niagara-on-the-Lake and see something at The Shaw Festival. However, we are still waiting for the follow-up invitation.
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Post by billontour on Nov 6, 2019 22:09:45 GMT
Spinning this thread from discussions in the Almeida 2020 thread. While there are playwrights and plays that seem to come around every couple of years like Arthur Miller, Noel Coward, Shakespeare etc there are others that don't get the same treatments. I wonder why that is, is it to do with the rights holders or simply that some playwrights or plays simply fall out of favour for a time. At the risk of being trolled to oblivion, can I make a plea for Aphra Behn or Thomas Heywood. I am old enough to remember 'The Fair Maid of the West' in the Swan's first season at the RSC and at the Mermaid- granted heavily adapted by Trevor Nunn - but what a wonderful, joyful production that was, with none of the current caveats on gender etc imposed. Blissfully funny, extremely over egged (and hammy to boot) and for once wasn't challenging or experimental or "woke" but just a lovely night's entertainment. Aphra Behn's 'The Rover' and Jonson's 'Every Man in his humour' the same season were also joyful. Moving to more modern times, I loved '2 guvners ' but how about the Scots version " A servaint of twa maisters" or Timberlake Wertenbaker's 'Our Country's Good' paired with 'The Recruiting Officer', or 'The Shaughran'? Some of the most joyeous nights I have had in the theatre. Also hoping to hit Stratford Festival next summer, Colm Feore in Richard 111 and The Miser, plus Spamalot, Wolf Hall and the Shakespeares. I just want to enjoy watching playwrights and plays at their finest :-) ' |
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Post by Polly1 on Nov 6, 2019 22:17:52 GMT
There was a very well-reviewed production of The Rover quite recently at Stratford, it was a great pity it didn't transfer to London.
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