17 posts
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Post by kryz1000 on May 12, 2017 7:13:17 GMT
I saw this in a late preview last weekend and thought it admirably ambitious, interestingly political and with moments of great visual and textual poetry. I think one star reviews are harsh and got me thinking about whatever (anti Norris?) agendas might be being exercised. At a basic level, this year's programming caters to a much wider audience than before - with stories and characters and directors that speak to and, perhaps, for them. I hope they come.
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Post by crabtree on May 12, 2017 8:41:43 GMT
I love the NT live, but the last few I have seen have been somewhat plagued with technical problems, mainly being out of synch, which is pretty disastrous for a play.
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716 posts
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Post by theatre-turtle on May 12, 2017 8:53:01 GMT
1* in the daily mail today.
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Post by Deleted on May 18, 2017 8:53:06 GMT
Well. I almost volunteered to put my own head on the platter if it could have ended sooner.
There's a lot of walking s-l-o-w-l-y for those who like that kind of thing. The revolve does a nice bit of work which is always nice and there's a bit of ladder work which breaks things up a little.
Now I'm all for a bit of revisionist text but the main problem here is that Salome just isn't that interesting in this. There's some other version of her talking to the audience from a ramp at the front of the stage but the younger version has all of the stage presence and expression of a slightly damp tea towel. God knows how she managed to incite a revolution but she does cover herself in sand rather thoroughly so I appreciate her conviction.
There are some nice visual moments and the dance where she's wafting around a few old curtains is rather effective. The singing is good also. The script is a pile of old twaddle and mostly delivered like the cast have only just read it and can't believe how dreadful it is.
John the Baptist comes out of it best, even though he spends all of his time in a loincloth. Seems a shame he ends up the way he does but then perhaps in the end it was a blessed relief for him.
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Post by Deleted on May 18, 2017 8:56:01 GMT
Oh and I don't think I've ever seen the Olivier that empty either.
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Post by Jan on May 18, 2017 9:04:05 GMT
Oh and I don't think I've ever seen the Olivier that empty either. I wonder how badly they suffer from their generous returns policy - how many people cash in their tickets for a credit note following. bad reviews ?
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Post by Deleted on May 18, 2017 9:56:35 GMT
Oh and I don't think I've ever seen the Olivier that empty either. You clearly didn't go back into Fram after the interval then...!
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Post by n1david on May 18, 2017 13:15:02 GMT
Oh and I don't think I've ever seen the Olivier that empty either. I wonder how badly they suffer from their generous returns policy - how many people cash in their tickets for a credit note following. bad reviews ? I think there's a good chance of that. I'll usually book for most things at the NT and then return if I hear bad things or don't fancy it when it gets nearer the time. The alternative is hearing about an amazing hit and then not being able to get decent tickets. If they're going for a more diverse audience, there may be more returns than there were in the Hytner era, wonder if they will have to increase the charge? I think it's interesting that Hytner has carried that policy over to the Bridge, although they have many fewer productions and so may be carrying a higher proportionate level of unused credit at any time.
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5,495 posts
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Post by Baemax on May 18, 2017 13:22:36 GMT
Although the first Bridge Theatre season looks to have far fewer risky prospects than the average NT season. Even if, say, the reviews for Young Marx come back proclaiming it to be the stinker to end all stinkers, people will still go along anyway because they like that Rory Kinnear or they enjoyed One Man Two Guvnors and what do critics know anyway. Good on Hytner for taking the policy with him, but I think it's far more likely to be used by people who have genuine conflicts than people who just book anyway 'cos they know it's not the same thing as committing (and even at the NT I don't imagine that's a huge proportion of people who return tickets, though I don't know how you'd monitor that).
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Post by Deleted on May 18, 2017 13:40:15 GMT
I've used it once or twice and that was only for genuine conflicts, as you say, not because I changed my mind about the show. Though the higher ticket prices at the NT now might mean I use it more - for eg, I am really considering it for Salome, which I paid £50 for (with extra Friday night tax...). If it was £30 I'd go with an open mind and see for myself but £50 is too much to chuck away on something that sounds fairly dire. I've also lost a lot of goodwill for the NT lately so I'm not willing to suck up a stinker to be supportive.
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81 posts
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Post by addictedtotheatre on Jun 10, 2017 11:06:35 GMT
In rehearsal.
Actor to Director: 'Won't all this constant wailing get on people's nerves?' Director: 'It'll be fine' Audience: starts wailing in their heads after 30 minutes
Actor to Director: 'Won't my speaking in a foreign language distance my character from the audience?' Director: 'It'll be fine' Audience: these surtitles are really making it hard to follow.
Actor to Director: 'Why, if I'm wearing historical costume have I been given an uzi machine gun?' Director: 'It'll be fine' Audience: 'Well, that's a jarring inconsistency'
Actor to Director: 'Shouldn't I be dancing with veils to seduce Herod, rather than tugging on some curtains?' Director: 'It'll be fine' Audience: Snigger
And so on. Lesson: writers should not be allowed to direct their own work as they have no distance to re-interpret for the audience.
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1,103 posts
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Post by mallardo on Jun 10, 2017 11:10:04 GMT
Three of the four points you ridicule were, to me, things that actually worked in the production.
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1,465 posts
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Post by foxa on Jun 10, 2017 11:50:16 GMT
I returned my tickets for this - and good thing too as we are suffering a serious of catastrophes including a mysterious 3 feet of water appearing in our basement. I am, at this moment, waiting for a company called 'Man Tank' to help us. Returned the tickets in person, box office was pleasant and efficient and issued credit note. Next to me a woman was returning four expensive tickets for 'Common.'
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1,465 posts
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Post by foxa on Jun 10, 2017 11:59:40 GMT
Ha. The water is still slowly rising.
And because we are the way we are, we were trying to figure out what play this was like. I thought Beckett's Happy Days where Winnie is submerged, finally up to the neck, in sand. Husband thinks there is a play where people keep looking out the window at rising water. And I'm like, no, that Ionesco's Rhinoceros - but it was Rhinoceroses not water and so on....Oh to have so much useless knowledge but no idea how to deal with something practical like this.
Also very surprised not to have a reaction from anyone about 'Man Tank.'
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1,093 posts
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Post by samuelwhiskers on Jun 10, 2017 12:21:37 GMT
Presumably it's a company that transforms leaks into convenient tanks of water to keep recalcitrant men in?
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5,495 posts
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Post by Baemax on Jun 10, 2017 13:19:45 GMT
The Sandi Toksvig play involved flooding (with water, not rhinos or sand ), as did the Steve Waters double bill The Contingency Plan. I'm sure there must be loads of others.
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1,310 posts
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Post by tmesis on Jun 10, 2017 15:03:04 GMT
Oh my god will the wailing never stop? (It didn't) Will we have that low sustained bass note that's such a cliche to add spurious tension ALL the way through? (we did) Will it ever show a spark of dramatic tension? (no) Was it one of the longest 1hr 45mins of my life? (undoubtably)
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Post by n1david on Jun 10, 2017 22:18:39 GMT
Returned the tickets in person, box office was pleasant and efficient and issued credit note. Next to me a woman was returning four expensive tickets for 'Common.' Off topic for this thread, but I returned my tickets for Common in person today... and the person next to me was doing the same...
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Post by lynette on Jun 10, 2017 22:32:26 GMT
I posted my Common tix back! They must be flooded with returns.
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Post by bellboard27 on Jun 12, 2017 20:45:17 GMT
Went tonight. Theatre about 2/3 full. I liked some of the staging but this is dreadful.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2017 19:34:21 GMT
I was really wanting to see this before the reviews, and didn't catch the live screening. Can anyone tell me if its worth seeing the encore because I'm still quite wanting to see it. Would it be a complete waste of time and money?
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Post by RedRose on Jun 25, 2017 9:24:15 GMT
I was really wanting to see this before the reviews, and didn't catch the live screening. Can anyone tell me if its worth seeing the encore because I'm still quite wanting to see it. Would it be a complete waste of time and money? YES!
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1,103 posts
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Post by mallardo on Jun 25, 2017 10:59:57 GMT
I was really wanting to see this before the reviews, and didn't catch the live screening. Can anyone tell me if its worth seeing the encore because I'm still quite wanting to see it. Would it be a complete waste of time and money?
It depends on what interested you about it in the first place. If you're a fan of Wilde's play then forget it - it's not that. It is an attempt to give context (and content) to what is really just a fragment of a story. The attempt is not successful - as the reviews above can attest - but one can find value in it. If you know Yael Farber's work you would expect some stunning stage images and they are there. And the story Ms Farber has concocted is not entirely bogus.
It's chief problem, for me, is that it takes itself so very seriously that it ends up as arch and portentous. Having said that, you will not have seen anything like it before - both a good and a bad thing. But you'll have to decide.
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Post by Baemax on Jun 25, 2017 13:09:02 GMT
If you've read this entire thread up until this point and still haven't been completely turned off the idea, then you may as well go.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2017 14:08:58 GMT
Thanks everyone. Think I'm gonna go and maybe just get a drink (or two) before I see it.
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Post by horton on Jun 27, 2017 14:29:00 GMT
Well add me to the small list of people who found this production absorbing.
True, it's not a comfortable Alan Bennett comedy of manners or cozy star vehicle for a slumming-it movie star, but what this play offers is a challenging, thought-provoking piece of theatre. Farber's use of ancient rite and ritual, impressive physicality and provocative visual juxtaposition make for the kind of drama Peter Hall could pull off in his prime. The sequence leading to the Baptist's death was genuinely one of the most thrilling things I've seen in quite some time.
For those people who said that it was hard to follow, or that the sound was alienating, or that it wasn't like Wilde, that sounds to me like they think all drama is meant to be comfortable and easy. "Oh no he's speaking in a foreign language"- that's really a complaint? "Oh no, there aren't seven veils"- go and see Wilde's play as he invented that dance!
I've been very critical of a lot of work at the National under Norris, but this production is a work of art by a visionary theatre practitioner.
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Post by PalelyLaura on Jun 28, 2017 11:16:59 GMT
I have to admit, I liked this much more than I had expected to. I do like Yael Farber, mind.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 11, 2017 20:22:05 GMT
Maybe I'm just not a very good theatre critic, but I just got back from the encore screening and found it utterly encapsulating. I couldn't look away from the screen, and my mother was the same. Particularly the last half hour from Iokanaan's cistern scene onwards was some of the most effective theatre I've seen all year. Standouts were Isabella Nefar who was able to convey such unimaginable pain and isolation without words and Olwen Fourere, who kept the pace and built in intensity to a dramatic and powerful conclusion. Women Of Song also sustained an engaging atmosphere throughout, very talented. Personally I didn't find the script to be too lacking and was able to follow it quite easily. In my opinion, this production has been judged far too harshly but I am only one.
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Post by SageStageMgr on Jul 11, 2017 21:22:19 GMT
Ah Salomé, what a woman, what a part...
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Post by lonlad on Jul 11, 2017 22:39:35 GMT
If you have to see it at all, which I don't advise, the show is best watched and not heard. The script is thunderously awful.
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